Against Sexual Exploitation

The Clap (Collective des luttes pour l'abolition de la prostitution) (does anyone else think it's funny that a group who is anti prostitution picked a name whose acronym is slang for gonorrhea?)

I don't know if they chose their name properly, that's for sure. And yes, it's funny in a sad way, as in their ignorance comes into play :lol:

It could be that in French 'the clap' doesn't have the same meaning. I don't know, I'm not French.

Maybe if I'm doing anything, I might show up. Support my ladies. Maybe some post-meeting celebrations.

I can for sure hold my own if I'm attacked. Plus, being Anglo, I won't know what's being said.

Verbally attacked, not physically.

I can for sure hold my own if I'm attacked. Plus, being Anglo, I won't know what's being said.

I will try my best to go their on Thursday. I must support my ladies. I'm sure a lot of members here would love to go and show their support for the lovely ladies in this profession, but unfortunately, many have SO's and would have a difficult time to attend. I hope to see you there Erin.

It doesn't matter how hard they try, no one has succeeded to eradicate to oldest job on earth! From what I could read, it seems like it's against sexual exploitation where woman and young kids are forced to become prostitutes against their will. It's doesn't sound like a rally to get rid of wonderful SP's of our region, who does what they do to please us and enjoy doing it!

That's only my 2 cents. :-D

To me, an independant or anyone working for an agency is not exploited...I don't understand these groups who think people in the trade are being exploited...some small cases maybe, but you definately can't paint a broad stroke onto this industry. These groups should be trying to legalise the sex trade, Nevada is a good example on how it can work. if they want safety for women and men in the trade, push to bring it out into the open!

If I was there, I would most definately attend. I choose to work in the sextrade, and that doesn't mean I am exploited at all. Hell who knows, maybe a move to Ottawa is in order LOL

Good luck with this, you are going to need it. I would go but I would probably end up in jail.

I hate to say it but you may be "pissing into the wind" with this group. I googled the organization and the speakers and you are going against some "professional" academics who make their living with these theories. Some of the stuff they are against such as child pornography or exploitation, or human trafficking are admirable causes and basically motherhood causes. However as far as I can see it is all tied into a marxist/socialist or radical feminist agenda. Not that I am against equal rights or am by any means a misogynist but some of the radical feminist ideas are absolute clap-trap. The late Andrea Dworkin's theories spring to mind.

Anyway, I doubt it will be anything more than a hyper-intellectual circle jerk, and in my experience they will not be interested in opposing views. Be prepared to be patronized and shouted down. The good news is that these people rarely have any real influence on real life policies and laws. The law-makers are surprisingly intelligent enough to realize that it is nothing more than some extreme left-wing intellectual masturbation.

EDIT- Lest I offend any academics or intellectuals my rant above was about that group and not academics in general. These people are not interested in debate, and will not tolerate opposing views. They are at the extreme end of the spectrum.

I think the truth is somewhere in the middle.

Just because we are independent and chose this type of work it doesn't mean everybody did.

I have a hard time believing that a teenager running away from an abusive home ends up in the hands of pimps and drug dealers because she wants to. And I am wondering if the hundreds of Asian girls on CL are working as prostitutes because they want to.

Just read the ads. Daily new girls from those countries who don't even speak the language and someone else is placing the ads for them.

Well, it is possible that girls in Asia are standing in line to be able to come to Canada to make money as prostitutes, but what if they are not? What if they are being lured here in the hope of some other type of work?

I think BECAUSE we are strong and independent women, we have the obligation to look out for those who can't speak up for themselves. If there is a problem, we should not help to sweep it under the rug.

Having said that, I think it is an absolute nonsense to say that everybody in the sex industry is exploited. The majority is in this because they want to, whether to make good money or because they enjoy what they do.

Sorry if I didn't sound sympathetic to your points. I am very aware of the problems with exploitation around the world. And I realize that they are problems that need to be addressed. But the arguments have to be reasonable and propose a reasonable and effective solution.

My points were based on having read and quickly researched what the authors have published. I will admit my French is not 100% but basically these people are on the radical end of the spectrum when it comes to feminism and they are anti-globalism as well. According to some of them, it is the evils of the G8 and G20 that are exploiting people for sex. They think that making prostitution illegal will be a solution to the problems. I on the other hand, would suggest it is a cause of many of the problems. Either way, from what I read in what Erin posted and what these "experts" have published, I seriously doubt that it will be a forum for informed debate.

Is there an English version of what they are talking about?

Is there an English version of what they are talking about?

I couldn't find much about them or their papers in English, but I only researched a little. Some of their papers are in English. Just google the 4 speakers/authors names and you will get some stuff.

Thanks for the translation, I know I understood what was said, but couldn't write it in coherent English. Essentially a bunch of self-proclaimed "experts" espousing their questionable academic research.

Annessa, if you go there and get all tense and frustrated and want someone to help release all that anger...I'm your man :) ...you are absolutely gorgeous

I still think that this little shindig is not really about the adult industry...but sure, the slant is likely on the feminism-left side of the political spectrum and deep down the CLAP is probably for the eradication of men in general. They will likely link these problems to the existance of the sex trade in general and point a finger at the customers as responsible for creating the demand...and oh yes...that the media is partly responsible for all that sex on TV and on the net. I would hope that there is an agreement on some basic principles (the main theme of the speak)...why can't we just get along already!

 

Matthew McGowan was arrested for making a sexually explicit safe sex video with two of his friends. One of the boys in the video was fourteen. All three boys were above the age of consent for sex, which is fourteen. They made the video of their own free will and they had safe sex. The charge was no doubt premised on a ruling that casual gay encounters are "degrading and without human dimension." (Judge Hayes ruling under the Butler framework).

 

Just, on the whole, IMHO, we are too quick to use the word "abuse" when referring to childhood sexual experiences. And if you can consent to sex at fourteen, why, when money is involved, does it now become illegal to sleep with anyone aged 14-17 (who the Child Porn Bill classifies as children)?

I think the law is there to prevent some religious fanatic from reporting 14 year old high school sweethearts if they are caught having sex, and to make sure if a 14 year old girl gets pregnant she can get married without being prosecuted.

But call me old fashioned. If I had a 14 year old son and someone made a porn movie with him I would cut his &*%^&$ off, I don't care if he consented or not. A 14 year old might be mature sexually, but mentally is still a child and can be very easily influenced.

I would not want my child to learn how to be a porn star before he finishes school and decides on a carrier. When he is old enough he can do porn movies if this is what he wants to do, but not at fourteen.

There is a beautiful, but sinister and haunting movie made in the Czech Republic about young male prostitutes and pornography. It is fact-based and some of the actors are actual young male prostitutes in Prague.

It is called "Mandragora", made in 1997. I would suggest to everybody to watch it.

http://www.amazon.com/Mandragora-Miroslav-Caslavka/dp/6305777837/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top

I have rented it, but it is available for free on the internet if you know where to look ;)

Once you've watched it I am absolutely sure you won't be able to trivialize the damages child prostitution and exploitation can do to young people.

All I can say is don't step to me with your bullshit unless you've got evidence to back it up.

You go girl! The more you talk/type the more I like :grin: BTW great taste in glasses, my Gucci frames are similar to yours ;) Great minds think alike

I think the truth is that there is no way of abolishing sex work, because there will always be people who need it and women who want to provide it.

I think that sex work is truly empowering as long as it is the woman's choice, no one is forcing her, she keeps all the money, she can choose who she wants to see and she is not a minor.

Every other scenario, like minors, or forced prostitution by a boyfriend or a pimp is the opposite: it is not freedom, but oppression.

We have to differentiate between the two.

As far as abolitionists are concerned, I think we should just let them talk, nobody takes them seriously. In every country, even in the US where prostitution is illegal, it is widely tolerated.

I think that most governments consist of men, and men understand their fellow men's need for this service. :)

Once in a while they punish one that is stupid enough to get caught, like Eric Spitzer, but not because he is using the service, but because he is so stupid that he endangers other people's fun.